15 Nov 2022 21:32 in discussion@conference.nuegia.net
sierra
[21:32:56]
hello
agris
[21:32:58]
hi
* sierra hugs
[21:32:58]
agris
[21:33:02]
it works now
hi ely
sierra
[21:33:37]
hi ely
* sierra hugs
[21:33:39]
how are you feeling?
agris
[21:33:58]
me?
sierra
[21:34:06]
both
agris
[21:34:11]
tense
but i'm ok
sierra
[21:34:54]
ely: you?
sierra
[21:37:26]
we just want to know more about what happened with jae and your conversation with cheapie
agris
[21:38:17]
i don't think they are here
agris
[21:41:47]
thanks for trying sierra
* sierra hugs agris
[21:42:32]
* agris hugs back
[21:42:41]
Elysian the Kitsune
[21:49:43]
you two should do lewd things u/w/u
sierra
[21:53:49]
Elysian the Kitsune: nice nick
Elysian the Kitsune
[21:54:49]
wdym nice nick?
sierra
[21:55:09]
It sound powerful to say Elysian the Kitsune
agris
[21:55:21]
who is this?
Elysian the Kitsune
[21:55:37]
i see
sierra
[21:55:42]
agris: ely
the kitsune
agris
[21:55:49]
oh
Elysian the Kitsune
[21:55:50]
agris this is deez
agris
[21:56:06]
> we just want to know more about what happened with jae and your conversation with cheapie
if you could share logs of your conversation with cheapie and jae
I'm also here to answer questions you might have
Elysian the Kitsune
[21:56:35]
i never contacted jae
but before i share information, i want to be promised something
sierra
[21:59:07]
that we don't ban you?
Elysian the Kitsune
[21:59:21]
yes, that
agris
[21:59:45]
yeah. i understand you said some reactionary things when you thought i intentionally banned you
Elysian the Kitsune
[21:59:53]
all of my opions that will be shared will be unbiased, and will not be affected by current relationships
agris
[21:59:55]
sorry for the misunderstanding
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:00:01]
it's okay
agris
[22:00:09]
i didn't know that was you
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:02:22]
it's fine
agris
[22:05:42]
yes i can promise you that
please go ahead
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:06:23]
ok let me pull up the chat logs
ok, so agris
you remember when cheapie banned you on freenode?
agris
[22:07:27]
not the exact date it was a while ago
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:08:24]
well, you said that cheapie decided to randomly bully you, right?
agris
[22:09:19]
are you going to share the log?
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:09:41]
well
https://gist.githubusercontent.com/cheapie/cddfe5aa1a33303329707c958611228c/raw/0674ab8aa68384a01ef9f2263e0a9e5c379c9700/gistfile1.txt
i found this
> I also took a look at the logs from old ##furry on freenode and I see that I am the one that banned him from there (for being a troll), although as I mentioned previously I'm not sure if he was ever actually banned from the one here.
so it seems you are NOT banned on libera
agris
[22:12:08]
Elysian the Kitsune, I'm asking for your log with cheapie
also i'm curious what happens after that log ends
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:14:01]
this conversation took place on matrix
i do not share whole matrix chat logs
sorry
but i can summarize my findings
agris
[22:14:21]
no
share the log please
you said you would
that is what we agreed upon
sierra
[22:15:17]
Elysian the Kitsune: can you share part of the logs?
or just take a screenshot of the important parts
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:15:34]
i am trying to export the logs right now
sierra
[22:15:46]
ok
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:17:34]
https://upload.yax.im/upload/sKIIhAa-KWpKPyJa/matrix%20-%20cheapie%20-%20Chat%20Export%20-%202022-11-16T06-16-32.313Z.txt
https://upload.yax.im/upload/sKIIhAa-KWpKPyJa/matrix - cheapie - Chat Export - 2022-11-16T06-16-32.313Z.txt
agris
[22:18:43]
thankyou ely
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:18:48]
np
agris
[22:18:50]
give me a minute to read this
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:18:54]
ok
agris
[22:22:19]
Ely
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:22:37]
yes?
agris
[22:22:41]
The log of freenode that cheapie provided does not demonstrate that I was a "troll"
What it demonstrates is me having a discussion with someone about javascript and web browser and 3d demos
What it demonstrates is me having a discussion with someone about javascript and web browser and 3d demos
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:23:45]
do you want the good news or the bad news first?
agris
[22:23:50]
and then cheapie butting in and interupting that discussion from which they were not even a part of
permanant ban
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:25:18]
wdym permaban?
agris
[22:25:33]
permanantly banned
to discussion no nothing
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:26:07]
i thought i was promised to not be banned
agris
[22:26:19]
no i'm saying that's what cheapie did to me
it's right there in the log see?
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:26:26]
oh
i see
agris
[22:27:04]
also there has been a group of stalkers going around to literally every place on the internet I hung out on and getting me banned
threatening my friends
telling them not to talk to me or they'll prevent them from being able to talk to their other friends
spreading defamatory rumors about me
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:27:55]
i will need proof of this
before i can discuss that further
agris
[22:28:47]
I'm not ready to release all of those details at this time, as it may put me or some of my friends at risk for they safety
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:29:09]
i see
agris
[22:29:14]
what I do release I need to discuss it to determine if it is safe to
eventually it will be fully release
eventually it will be fully released, but until then if you have a specific and finite thing you need proof of I may be able to provide that
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:30:12]
well, untill i can access those details, i am sorry but i might not be as much help to you
agris
[22:30:49]
that's ok. I wasn't under the expectation that you'd be able to help me anyways.
I'll see what I can share with you
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:35:37]
thank you
anyways, i'm thinking of settling down for the night
let's continue with this tomorrow
* sierra hugs ely
[22:38:47]
thankyou for your help
agris
[22:39:16]
distaza says he has something he wants to say on that
sierra, can you get ely back?
sierra
[22:40:09]
ely is here
I think
agris
[22:40:21]
> Elysian the Kitsune has left
> [22:38:23]
sierra
[22:40:31]
oh
agris
[22:41:09]
ely
hold on a minute distaza is joining
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:41:33]
i haven't reloaded blabber so it doesn't know that this room is in my bookmarks
oh ok
agris
[22:41:47]
there is something we can share with you now safely
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:42:15]
ok, go ahead
distaza
[22:42:36]
Hey, just read the log you provided, ely
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:43:04]
ok
distaza
[22:43:28]
Just wanna say, it's one thing to have a talk with someone about their attitude, or voice a concern, or even take someone aside for a moment and give them an ultimatum.
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:43:45]
ok
distaza
[22:43:46]
That's, in my opinion, a necessity of good moderation practices.
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:43:56]
i see
distaza
[22:43:59]
Y'know, treating people like, well, people.
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:44:15]
agreed
distaza
[22:44:24]
Note that this example is one-and-done. The log provided was not provided to me. It was not provided to Agris.
His ban reason is 'Enough'.
Thee was no discussion.
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:44:48]
actually
distaza
[22:44:49]
There wasn't even a clear impetus.
Unless I'm mistaken...
Which, if I am, please do corect me. I want to know as much as possible so that I can prevent misunderstandings.
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:45:50]
oh wait, agris was banned
distaza
[22:45:58]
Yeah.
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:46:04]
i did not notfice the mode change
distaza
[22:46:13]
They didn't even tell you, huh?
agris
[22:47:01]
+b means ban
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:47:03]
nono, i looked over it
agris
[22:47:06]
irc is clunky
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:47:09]
yeah, i know
> Aug 28 18:50:54 <Agris> Your project is going to turn out unreliable, bloated, and is not going to have any longevity at all. It's also going to suck of gigabytes of ram and rev up cpu cores if you decide to build graphics in a web browser
this raises concerns
agris
[22:48:14]
what concerns? Digital archival? Accessibility?
distaza
[22:48:18]
Sure, but that's something that can be debated civilly, not with a hammer to a nail attitude. I'd argue it's the hammer to nail attitude that a ban is supposed to protect -against-, isn't it?
(From a technical perspective, it's blunt, but there are some points to be made about JS and being hog-tied to Chromium. But I digress.)
agris
[22:49:34]
especially 3D gaphics demos
*graphics
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:50:12]
still
distaza
[22:50:16]
The problem isn't whether or not the point is valid, or even imo whether the tone was polite or not in that quip, but that that one line is all it takes to just one-and-done boot a person, any person, from a chat, without discussion, recourse, anything.
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:50:23]
that line seems really agressive
distaza
[22:50:25]
Not even a reason bit a glib one-liner!
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:50:48]
listen, im gonna call it a night
agris
[22:50:53]
for a person who's been a member of a chat for years
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:50:57]
i'm really tired
distaza
[22:51:02]
Not even a reason but a glib one-liner!
That's understandable - it's a long night for me, too.
agris
[22:51:28]
anyways, hopefully that gives you what you needed ely
Elysian the Kitsune
[22:51:28]
thank you
good night
agris
[22:51:35]
thank you for sharing the logs too ely
goodnighjt
sierra
[22:51:48]
goodnight kitsunes
agris
[22:51:59]
sierra <3
* sierra hugs Elysian the Kitsune's gut and hugs agris
[22:52:01]
agris
[22:52:16]
also ely
distaza
[22:52:22]
I don't mean to diminish your take on it either, you have a point about bluntness, Elysian the Kitsune, but notwithstanding, an admin should be able to act within reason, which means talking to people before, or even after, they ban.
agris
[22:52:25]
something for you to keep in mind
distaza
[22:52:34]
This isnt rocket science, it's transparency.
agris
[22:52:43]
that could happen to you too in anything cheapie is an admin of
and that will be the end of it.
cheapie still hasn't spoken a single word to me since that ban
your just gone
distaza
[23:11:45]
Parting thought, ely, so that I don't forget in the morning: you should ask your acquaintance cheapie if they would repeat the actions they did to Agris to someone else exactly, under the same circumstances.